fair warning

[thehefner]

The next FIREFLY/SERENITY fan who tells me that they hate westerns (or have no interest in ever watching westerns), I am going to tackle, wrap in a burlap sack, and force them via Ludovico Technique to watch THE GOOD, THE BAD, AND THE UGLY, BUTCH CASSIDY AND THE SUNDANCE KID, OPEN RANGE, TOMBSTONE, and ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST.

I will also provide beer and chips, don't worry. It's not torture, after all. It's rehabilitation. Hell, I'll strap myself in right next to 'em! "Don't bogart those eye drops!"

I'm not quite at this point of frustration with people who claim to hate zombie movies yet love SHAUN OF THE DEAD, but they keep pushing me. Why oh why do they keep pushing me?



On happier things, I am now into volume 2 of CONCRETE, which is one of the most poetically beautiful, serene comics I've ever read. No, it's probably the top. It's definitely going on the list of my top serene, calming, zen things, alongside Garrison Keillor performing Lake Wobegon monologues, Werner Herzog's voice, and David Lynch's THE STRAIGHT STORY.

Lovely stuff.



Oh, and I just had a great time ranting with a customer at the comic store about how PIRATES 3 made absolutely no fucking sense and was absolute twaddle. A list of the problems that come to mind off-hand:

--The Kraken. So, wait, the big monster from the second movie dies off-screen. Aside from how utterly anticlimactic that it in of itself, I have to ask, HOW did it die? Presumably it was killed by the East India Trading Company, at the behest of Lord Snooty McEvilBrit. OK, uh, why? "Nya-ha, we now control Davy Jones and all he has within his power! Let's start by killing the single greatest weapon at his--and now subsequently, our-- disposal! Brilliant!"

-- All the new pirates. Look at all these new characters! Ain't they neat! Ohhh, they're all going into battle, awesome! And they... do nothing. No, no, wait, they're... raising their flags. Oh. Um. Well done. You certainly earned your screentime and fancy costumes. Now as a reward, you'll be played in an RPG by some bitter kid who, like everyone else, wanted to be Jack Sparrow. Just like those kids who were too late to play Han Solo and had to settle for Bib Fortuna. Because really, was there any other point to these guys than to create some half-assed mythology?

-- Calypso: proof positive that they were making this shit up as they went along. Seriously, was there ANY inkling in PIRATES 2 that Tia Dalma was anything other than a voodoo fortune teller who was suspiciously hot even with the bad teeth? Then PIRATES 3 comes along and whoop! All of a sudden she goes from sly to angsty and is a goddess! No, seriously now, you guys didn't know at all where you were going after PIRATES 2 when you wrote it, did you?

-- No swashbuckling. Seriously, was there any real swashbuckling? The first one had it in spades, and the second at least had that great three-way Jack/Will/Norrington fight, give or take the big wheel. If PIRATES 3 had any real swashbuckling of note, it was utterly overwhelmed (drowned out, even) by the huge, pointless spectacle around it.

-- Pirates as noble heroes. "What side are you on, Norrington??! HUH?!" "Uhh, the side that didn't just try to rape you three minutes ago?" Seriously, that whole speech about pirates being equated to freedom and the opening of the pirates all being depicted as some goddamn LES MISERABLES la resistance group... yes, freedom to rape, murder, pillage, and steal. Way to go, Kiera! (seriously, Chow Yun Fat really just tried to rape you a couple scenes earlier. You remember that, right? Just checking)

-- Lord Snooty McEvilBrit on the exploding ship. Come ON, all that shit flying around, he had to at least have gotten ONE splinter in his eye! I couldn't get over how he seemed surrounded by this magical aura that protected him from all debris. Maybe when they bullshit the story for PIRATES 4: THE SEARCH FOR MORE MONEY, they can retroactively say that's how he survived.

And those are just what come to mind right now. I'm sure I'll think of more later, for the two or three other people who actually care. And hey, if I'm wrong about any points, I shall respectfully retract that complaint. But I think I'm right about most of 'em, anyway.

Ahh, that's much better; I'm ranted out for the time being. Back to work!

Comments

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

I've seen maybe half an episode of Firefly, but I would LOVE to watch all those Westerns again!!!

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

A girl after my own heart.

Seriously, even a Whedon-averse guy like me really, thoroughly dug FIREFLY, but that's due to large part for my love of westerns (a love Joss clearly shares) as well as how similar it was to FARSCAPE. I'll still take FARSCAPE any day, of course...

[suburbfabulous.livejournal.com]

The Curse Of Tan Pants.
Paul Chadwick has taught us much, Hef.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Tan Pants in the whozuh?

If that's a CONCRETE reference, remember: I'm only at book 2.

[suburbfabulous.livejournal.com]

Trust us, John.
You'll get it.
Somewhere around Killer Smile, I think.

[holli.livejournal.com]

If it helps, I don't like zombie movies because I am such a giant wuss that I just watched most of an episode of Doctor Who with the sound off because it was so scary. And I'm now sitting here going AAAH CAN'T SLEEP STATUES WILL EAT ME.

...sorry. Sorry. That was a scary fucking epsiode, is all.

Anyway! I suspect my enjoyment of Pirates 3 mostly stems from by ability to turn off the critical-thinking bits of my brain when necessary. But even with them on, the only thing that *really* bothered me was the lack of swashbuckling. Some of your other points were actually plusses for me: the Calypso stuff is sufficiently hinted at, for me, by her locket and some of her lines in 2; and the new characters and mythology give the universe what is, to me, a pleasing amount of complexity and depth. I mean, I kind of feel like a dumbass talking about the cosmology of the Pirates of the Caribbean universe, but it has one! And it's interesting!

Oh, and the Beckett death scene: totally fails at physics, but wins at dramatic impact. This being a film series where people have swordfights in a giant waterwheel, drama beats physics every time.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

No, I am totally forgiving of folks who can't endure gore and whatnot. But not so much the aversion to westerns. Like, "Oh no, dust! I can't watch!"

Aye, it clearly worked for a ton of people, but not me, and that's what it comes down to, sadly. That, and the fact that I am not swayed by the presence of pretty people.

So I'm afraid I still find it absolute twaddle and poppycock. But that's why we have livejournals, so we can bitch and rave as we like!

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Little by little, I shall. Rest assured of that.

[holli.livejournal.com]

really, isn't that what the Internet is for?

And, yeah, there is no reason to be Western-averse. Actually, I should see more of them, now I think about it.

[bimmin.livejournal.com]

Never been aversed to Westerns. I mean come ON...throw in the Victorian period...and if we're allowed to distance ourselves from gun fights sometimes (don't get me wrong, I do like a good gun fight) and instead throw in, oh, I dunno...cannibalism and what not I'm there....there and grinning.

Hmmmm...Straight Story AND zen a la Werner Herzog's voice???? Yet another thingy you've mentioned that I'll have to check out.


Old Boy soundtrack? How do you rock so much? It's simply un-possible!

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

I am slowly working towards getting my hands on FARSCAPE.

I like Westerns. I like science fiction. You'd think these things would combine better, but when people do it deliberately is sometimes falls flat. I had just seen a lot of anime trying to do it when FIREFLY began, so I was like "This had better not be OUTLAW STAR live"... and then I didn't have cable anymore! So. Haven't seen it.

[kali921.livejournal.com]

Best rant of 2007 thus far! When I finally DO see POTC3, I will bear these points in mind.

I TOLD YOU CONCRETE WAS GOOD.

[little-dinosaur.livejournal.com]

Haha, "absolute twaddle".
Sorry, that's all I can come up with. Still heavily medicated and should really not even be attempting texty communication.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

When the theatre cleared out, the overenthusiastic usher asked folks what they thought of the film. Guess which one was me?

"Awesome!"

"SO great."

"Absolute twaddle and poppycock!"

One of the girls turned to me and said, "... twaddle...?"

Also, NYAWWW. *pets medicated head ala Kevin McDonald as the father in KIDS IN THE HALL: BRAIN CANDY*

[hp-dmalfoy.livejournal.com]

Believe it or not, absolutely and totally agreed on "Pirates."

I think what got me most, for all that I had a good time watching the pretty, shiny people and fights, was the fact that by the time it was all over, everyone had managed to screw everyone else over so thoroughly, selfishly and completely unrepentantly that there was no one left to particularly care about. No heroes, no moments of shining self-sacrifice that turned the antiheroes back into heroes, none of the old sensation that they actually cared about each other. By the end, I didn't blame them for that much, because I didn't particularly care about them anymore either.

[hp-dmalfoy.livejournal.com]

(Whoops, this would be Jaki, by the bye.)

As long as we're on westerns...

[irish-caffeine.livejournal.com]

Have you seen The Proposition? If not, then DO! It's a western set in Australia starring Guy Pearce, with a screenplay by NICK CAVE! One of my top 5 from last year.

Re: As long as we're on westerns...

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

You're totally right I need to see it! Actually, that and The Three Burials of Melquiades Estrada with Tommy Lee Jones, those are supposedly the best damn westerns to come out in recent memory. Also, SERAPHIM FALLS with Liam Neeson and Pierce Brosnan; a western made my Irishmen!

I should have a triple feature some night.

[deliapuppeh.livejournal.com]

That and also why the hell did the Snooty McEvilBrit not do shit when they started firing upon him? He doesn't seem the type to just freeze up there on the deck and then do absolute shit.

Over all I had a good time at the movie, but it's true that there were a lot of things that didn't make sense.

[deliapuppeh.livejournal.com]

Also, I don't really like westerns because I'm not a fan of the shoot 'em up romance things. I liked Firefly because they had different stories each episode with wit and intrigue. Westerns make me go sleepy.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

That's a whole other aspect I hadn't considered, but you're quite right. One review for OCEAN'S 13 days that film pulled off the multiple betrayals much, much better than PIRATES 3.

Men. Norrington was the only one I cared about anyway. And he died in a quick, let's-get-rid-of-him fashion anyway, so whatever.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

A good western isn't a "shoot 'em up romance thing" anymore than FIREFLY is. Have you seen any of the films I listed above?

[little-dinosaur.livejournal.com]

Heehee. Better and better.

Oh god, so medicated. It's obvious now that I was never destined to be a glamourous pill-popping movie star; I do not know how they do it. My brains are absolutely goo.

[gnort.livejournal.com]

To be fair, most of the pirate's Elizabeth had associated with were honorable (chow yun fat notwithstanding) Sparrow was a good man at heart, Barbossa had a loyalty to the code and even the first mate guy who's name I can't recall seemed decent enough. So maybe her perspective on the pirate life is a bit warped. As for freedom the only explanation I can think of is the freedom of being out on the open sea, which Sparrow was so fond of.

I'm sure they'll make a fourth. They left it open with the search for the fountain of youth and let's face it now that LoTR is over this is really all Orlando Bloom has left.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Dude. They're PIRATES. They proved that even their "code" is BS (more like guidelines) when they really wanted something. Or did you not notice how everybody seemed to be betraying everyone else at a moment's notice?

But I can't say this enough: PIRATES. Not nice people!

Also, "left it open"?????? Dude, that's not leaving it open. That's "we're not gonna give any ending because we want more money from you suckers, so here's a tailor-made opening for a new movie to get said money from you, the said suckers. Yarr!"

[gore-whore-5.livejournal.com]

... I don't like westerns.
Can it be root beer instead of regular beer?

Also, I am glad I didn't see Pirates 3 on opening night. I still haven't seen it yet, and I will probably wait until it's out on DVD. Didn't think I'd say that, but oh well.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

How can a person not like an entire genre? Define a western in your mind. Tell me what they are and what you don't like about them.

I'll ask you the same as I asked Ri. Did you see any of the films I listed above?

Although that in of itself isn't an entirely fair question, because even if you've seen one, each of them is worlds different from the others. Which is why I put them all up there. Going back to genres, it's like comparing 2001, STAR WARS, ALIEN, GATTACA, THE TERMINATOR, ET. All sci-fi, all the same genre. You see what I'm getting at here?

A side note: Tarantino calls THE GOOD, THE BAD, AND THE UGLY the best directed film of all time, and it's one of his top, like, two films ever. FILMS, not "western." Genre names are just labels. Those films I listed above are there because they're excellent films.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Furthermore, read my response to Lea at the bottom.

Give BUTCH CASSIDY AND THE SUNDANCE KID a watch, at least. It's written by William "THE PRINCESS BRIDE" Goldman!

[gnort.livejournal.com]

"Also, "left it open"?????? Dude, that's not leaving it open. That's "we're not gonna give any ending because we want more money from you suckers, so here's a tailor-made opening for a new movie to get said money from you, the said suckers. Yarr!" "

Exactly...they left it open. Although I'm not sure who the supernatural villain would be with a fountain of youth story line but it's hollywood I'm sure they'll come up with some cockamamey story and turn it into a 2 movie arc.

I'm not disagreeing with you on the pirates = bad people thing I was just playing devil's advocate as to what her thought process actually was.

[gore-whore-5.livejournal.com]

I only said that so you would kidnap me and make me watch those movies and supply me with rootbeer and chips. Out of the ones you've listed, I've only seen Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, and I loved it. I also loved the Lonesome Dove miniseries with Robert Duvall. I have not seen many westerns, but I did see Chisum with John Wayne and it was horribly boring. He is mostly boring except for in The Quiet Man.

cue icon

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Nya-haa! But instead, you only incurred the geek wrath. Let that be a lesson!

(psh, you just want someone to tie you up in a burlap sack)

See, as I've said, I've never seen a John Wayne movie. I've never HEARD of Chisum, so that's probably a bad sign. That said, I should see THE SEARCHERS, where he plays an absolute fucking bastard, a very anti-Wayne character, or so I understand. And TRUE GRIT, where he's a grouchy old fatty who apparently kicks all manner of ass with one of the manliest lines of all time.

But totally do watch some of the others on the above list. The Sergio Leone ones are by far my favorites (TGTBATU and OUATITW) but be warned, they're incredibly deliberately paced films. Don't watch if you're ever in an ADD mood. Just find a big screen, crank the sound WAY up, and allow yourself to be immersed in slow-burn awesomeness and asskickery.

Re: cue icon

[gore-whore-5.livejournal.com]

Well, I can do without the burlap sack. But seriously, I want a western movie night with you. That would be really fun.

Another western I liked was The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. That was pretty cool. I don't remember a lot about it, but I remember liking it. (It's been a while since I've seen it)

Re: cue icon

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Could be fun! It's been a while since I've seen those Leone films in their entireity. You need to see 'em no matter what.

Also, I imagine you'll totally and completely dig TOMBSTONE. Especially for Val. But the Leone films, above and beyond all else, you must see. You could even do the entire "Man With No Name" trilogy, but be warned, the first one (FISTFUL OF DOLLARS) is the weakest by far.

Ah, LIBERTY VALANCE, that's one I need to see, meself!

Re: cue icon

[gore-whore-5.livejournal.com]

Aahh! I've wanted to see Tombstone for quite a while now. That looks like a whole lot of fun.

Would you mind making up a must-see list of movies for me? I have a to-see list of about 1,000, so I just want the essentials. Feel free to exclude ones you know I've seen (like Ravenous and Fight Club).

Re: cue icon

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Your e-mail, please?

Re: cue icon

[gore-whore-5.livejournal.com]

curseyourichards at gmail has got mail now.

[covenhouse-cat.livejournal.com]

I don't like a lot of westerns, but I'm usually willing to give them a chance. Feel free to kidnap me and make me watch westerns with you at any time, though. Beer, or Root Beer, may be replaced with Sarsparilla in my case.

I think I enjoy science fiction, noir, fantasy, suspense, or horror more overall, as genres go, but it's really about the rest of the film, not what its genre is. There are good and bad films in every genre.

I loved Firefly, Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid, and the television shows The Lone Ranger, Wild Wild West, and Maverick. But there is a crap ton of westerns that I can't stand, for the reasons of: few strong female characters, mistreatment of animals, too-shallow hero vs. villain storylines, gun=solution endings, and most of all, portrayal of Native Americans. I'll admit to being probably oversensitive to that last one, as I'm half Seminole, but that's my opinion.

"The Searchers" wasn't all that and a bag of chips, but it's watchable. If the Native American stereotypes don't set you off, you might like it.