No Violence Just Yet. Have a Milkshake.

[thehefner]

Dang it, for the past couple hours I've been trying to write an essay about why people go to see violent films, an entry provoked by the film FUNNY GAMES, which I just saw after falling in love with the evil, nasty trailer for the upcoming remake with Naomi Watts.

But violence in film is such a huge and complex subject, between the different uses of violence in storytelling to the question of man having a latent bloodthirsty nature, that the post keeps getting too huge and unwieldy. My main point--that people watch these kinds of violent films not to watch people suffer and die but rather to see the victims escape and triumph from their plight--is getting lost in the muck.

So I don't know. Maybe I will ultimately post it, or maybe I'll scrap it. I imagine you folks will have a few things to add or debate upon, so if it's posted at all, so I'd want the post to be as solid as possible.

So instead, I present you with this, from the great benchilada:

Comments

[kali921.livejournal.com]

I, for one, would read such an essay. I think there are a lot of reasons people enjoy seeing films that involve violence, but keep in mind that there are also plenty of people who intensely dislike same.

I have a friend who is the most sophisticated and eloquent cineaste that I've ever met. Her knowledge of film is legendary and unparalleled, I'll wager. She once said to me that she didn't mind the violence in Scorcese films because it's almost always integral to advancing the plot, and she argued that because of that, it's not gratuitous. After I thought about it, I agreed with her; someone like Scorcese never glamorizes violence.

Now, Herschell Gordon Lewis, on the other hand....

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

And that whole subject right there--a sub-subject to the main reason I started thinking about this in the first place--could easily take up multiple entries on its own!

I mean, HALLOWEEN, PSYCHO, SAVING PRIVATE RYAN, A CLOCKWORK ORANGE, DAWN OF THE DEAD, GRINDHOUSE, KILL BILL, THE TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE, THE GODFATHER, AMERICAN PSYCHO, RAMBO, TITUS ANDRONICUS, KING LEAR, and NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN... these all use violence for different purposes. And sometimes, the line between "art" and "not-art" can get blurred in the opinions of others.

For example, I seriously consider the original TEXAS CHAIN SAW MASSACRE to be a work of cinematic art, as vital as any of the greats in that golden era of 70's cinema. On the other hand, I consider the remake of THE TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE to be cheap, lazy, gory, exploitative, nasty, pointless, ugly shit.

Hell, you should read the reviews when John Carpenter's THE THING came out, calling it pointlessly violent and gory, whereas today most of us celebrate it as an intelligent masterpiece of horror. Where they wrong then? Are we wrong now? Who's to say?

It's a very tough subject, one where I doubt few people would totally agree. In a very big way, we're dealing with the subjectivity of art, how it's all in the eye of the beholder. One man's art is another man's schlock, and there are many other possible interpretations besides those two.

[yancentric.livejournal.com]

My main point--that people watch these kinds of violent films not to watch people suffer and die but rather to see the victims escape and triumph from their plight--is getting lost in the muck.

Interesting that you'd reach such a point after watching Funny Games...

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Well, I'm not sure what exactly you mean by that, but where I was coming from was that I think the director missed the point. I mean, I don't know, as I haven't read any interviews with him as to his intent, but there seem to be many people who read it as an indictment against people who watch violent movies to get off on the torture and suffering.

If that's the case, then I suspect the director has missed the point. The point being that most people don't want to see innocents tortured and killed, but rather, we want to see them escape and survive.

THAT SAID... by taking that expectation and turning it around on us, the director may understand after all. I'm just not sure. But whatever he thinks, many people seem to think that's why people go to see violent movies for those first reasons, and I wanted to dispute that.

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

Even more so that the poster, your icon is making me REALLY crave a milkshake.

And goddamn it, the only place I'll be near that makes them today is McDonalds. D:

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Damn it, me too. The hell with my diet.

[eliyes.livejournal.com]

Yay the booth chicky at work bought me a milkshake on her break! :D

...You have a woobie Doom icon. o.O

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Such things should just not be, and yet they are.

I too had a milkshake today. It was five fucking dollars, because it's a privately-owned ice creamery and not a chain or anything, but it was so bloody worth it. I have wasted my day at the gym, and I am pleased. Yay for mutual milkshakes!

[jellied.livejournal.com]

You're on a diet?

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Well, just trying to eat more sensibly anyway. In the short-term, I'd like to get as trim as possible for a high-end photo shoot of the Two-Face/Typhoid Mary costumes, just so I can have some super-sexy and well-done pictures for posterity, and so we can also work out the kinks in the designs.

We'll see how it goes, though. I eat better than I used to, but I still love sweets, cheese on everything, and beer.

[jellied.livejournal.com]

Oooh right, I think I'm on something similiar when I remember, said the girl who had two pieces of toast, an egg and an entire KFC meal for breakfast.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

As long as it wasn't a Famous Bowl, you're still my classy lady.

[greyhalfdrow.livejournal.com]

Now this may be a bad example but I saw Rambo saturday and unlike the previous Sly movies it in no way glorified violence. Infact they seemed to go out of the way to point out just how ugly fighting really is, and the mental toll that type of conflict can take on a person.

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

Now, some might disagree with you on that, but I'm not sure I'd be among them. The violence in RAMBO was more gory and explicit than any of the previous movies, yet it was handled with real intensity (compared to RAMBO: FIRST BLOOD PART II's over-the-top craziness, like blowing up one man with a single exploding arrow) and weight. So I think I'm with you on that.

[heleneotroy.livejournal.com]

Your icon is frightening.
Frightening, yet strangly alluring. . .

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

It will do until someone makes an animated "My milkshake brings all the boys to the yard" icon.

[heleneotroy.livejournal.com]

It makes me want to lick your mustache put my eyes out with a spoon.

[heykidzcomix.livejournal.com]

loilmen?

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

If he says he's a loilman, you will agree.

To paraphrase Counselor Murdock:

[suburbfabulous.livejournal.com]

Post the essay, Hef.
No one will get hurt.
...
>8)X

Re: To paraphrase Counselor Murdock:

[thehefner.livejournal.com]

We'll see, pally. We'll see.

Hell, I was hoping the discussion would start here, but so far, no one's responded to my responses to their comments. It'd be far easier to discuss it in a thread fashion than in the great big unwieldy chunk this thing is becoming (or may really need to become, if it's to be done well at all).

Re: To paraphrase Counselor Murdock:

[suburbfabulous.livejournal.com]

Nah. Blog the site from orbit...it's the only way to be sure.